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Celandra is a game in which the players take the roles of societies, rather than playing individual characters. The players will invent a society with its culture and heritage, and will guide its development and interaction with the world. Emphasis will be be placed on developing a detailed history of Celandra, along with myths and legends.
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AaronENowack
Aaron E Nowack

Tue

Aug 24
1999

14:41Z

[Cel] Razanians

> Okay, that sure explains why i cannot send anmything to Aaron. :/
> Me want to pay the Razanians, but  i still need information on them and
have
> questions. I know the rules and read them, just simply that the website
> wasn't updated for two months and don't what the actions concerning the
> Razanians are since turn 1408. Can anybody help?

The Razanians became NPS again after 1408, and were very quiet.  Until
1411, Aryisa was mainly concerned with internal matters as Duke Iyan and
the Crusaders seized power.  However, just recently a major invasion of
the Razanian Kingdoms has begun.  After a large battle in Karan (IIRC),
the razanian armies fled north to Taranta and the southern city-states
fell under siege.  However, most of the captured areas are only loosely
held.


>Yeah :) The only indication Aaron gave me that Arysa played by him is 
>currently in a big campaign to take over the rest of the Razanian
Kingdomss 
>and indicated that the Razanians may end up in Exile. Since 1408, I
would 
>think many things could of happened. Oh well.

Well hopefully, my post above answers your questions.

>Razanians reminds me of the Bajorans fighting for freedom from the 
>Cardassians and Arysa reminds me of the Clans in the Battletech books.

Yeh.  The Asagmari are a strange mix of the Jews (the Exodus from
Asagmar), Russia (serfdom in Aryisa is similar to the Russian system),
and the Clans (with the regent roughly analogous to the ilKhan, the
Crusaders are the Crusaders, and the guardians are the Wardens).  So what
recenly happened is the the ilKhan is missing, presumed dead, the Wardens
are all but extinct, and the Crusaders are the ruling power to put it in
battletech terms.  However rumors continue the the Regent and the
Guardians are merely in hiding not dead.

 
                                                   Aaron Nowack
"Never let reality get in the way of a good hypothesis."
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/5930/

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LouisPasztor
Louis Pasztor

Fri

Aug 27
1999

15:04Z

[Cel] Razanians

> > Okay, that sure explains why i cannot send anmything to Aaron. :/
> > Me want to pay the Razanians, but  i still need information on them and
>have
> > questions. I know the rules and read them, just simply that the website
> > wasn't updated for two months and don't what the actions concerning the
> > Razanians are since turn 1408. Can anybody help?
>
>The Razanians became NPS again after 1408, and were very quiet.  Until
>1411, Aryisa was mainly concerned with internal matters as Duke Iyan and
>the Crusaders seized power.  However, just recently a major invasion of
>the Razanian Kingdoms has begun.  After a large battle in Karan (IIRC),
>the razanian armies fled north to Taranta and the southern city-states
>fell under siege.  However, most of the captured areas are only loosely
>held.
>
Karan conquered? You make sound like the Crusaders have taking their over 
quite quickly. Base on that Kingdoms Description, I would think Karan should 
have a bonus due to their militiristic ways and their King being a great 
tactician/strategist then the other Razanian leaders.
I can understand the Crusaders attack more north, taking over Teren and 
Cantor and sieging the southern states, but attacking westwards also against 
Karan should of been hard, especially also when the Crusader forces would of 
been spreaded a bit to thin conquering everywhere practicly at the same 
period of time?
Also, the Razanians have been NPS for so many turns, so having just basic 
dull reactions to Aryisans advance. If they had a player playing, situations 
would of been different and the Crusaders would maybe have a harder time to 
taking over the remmants of the Razanian Kingdoms, especially now when they 
are more united by this time and especially Karan where i would think they 
would fend off the invaders.
Base on what you describe there, thats cutting half or most of the ideas i 
have for the Razanians. The ideas i have were base where the Crusaders would 
of had been only conquered Teren and Cantor so far and attacking towards the 
north while besieging the Southern kingdoms. But instead, seems half of or 
more the remmants of the Razanian Kingdoms have already been conquered. My 
ideas qere also base upon the idea that the Aryisans internal affairs would 
effect the attacks, like you said, until 1411. But from 1408 to 1411, I 
would think the Razanians would have time prepare and be more united so they 
can be really ready for war. Also, by this time, the Razanian Front would of 
intefered, sabotage, capture, hampering supplies for the Crusader troops, 
causing trouble basicly where the new Crusader like government would have to 
commit troops to defend against them, where the Razanian Front have enough 
time to smuggle what they need and to really cause trouble.
So a quick invasion which you described shouldn't of been really possible, a 
slow invasion would of been more like it.

I am just pointing facts here and i would think even a NPS society would of 
had a better reaction, like one i described. Also, like i said, I have read 
everything about the Razanians, Aryisans and their problems and 
understanding it quite well. I am not complaining or anything, just think 
would be a bit unfair towards the society, where the GM should of considered 
base upon the information after 1408 what the Razanians would have done 
where it would seem a bit more likely.
I know of the Aryisans Train Troops and their more superior tech level then 
the Razanians, but even then, The Razanians also haves advantages to balance 
out with the Aryisans advantages, so make things harder for the crusaders to 
conquer the Razanians as quickly as you described, where the Razanians also 
had thier Secondary Defence and them been more aware of a incoming invasion 
and get ready for it.
I know we cannot change things and what happened before, but it seems the 
Razanians do much and went dull as soon as they turned NPS, making them a 
easier target which is a bit annoying.


>Well hopefully, my post above answers your questions.

Yeah, atleast half or most of the questions i have. But would like still to 
have info about the Razanians actions since 1408? Any of them at all?

>
>
>Yeh.  The Asagmari are a strange mix of the Jews (the Exodus from
>Asagmar), Russia (serfdom in Aryisa is similar to the Russian system),
>and the Clans (with the regent roughly analogous to the ilKhan, the
>Crusaders are the Crusaders, and the guardians are the Wardens).  So what
>recenly happened is the the ilKhan is missing, presumed dead, the Wardens
>are all but extinct, and the Crusaders are the ruling power to put it in
>battletech terms.  However rumors continue the the Regent and the
>Guardians are merely in hiding not dead.
>

Yeah and like i said, they just remind me of the clans, but doesn't mean 
they should have a similar situation and happenings thought.

-LordLMP


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AaronENowack
Aaron E Nowack

Fri

Aug 27
1999

15:52Z

[Cel] Razanians

> Karan conquered? You make sound like the Crusaders have taking their 
> over 
> quite quickly. Base on that Kingdoms Description, I would think 
> Karan should 
> have a bonus due to their militiristic ways and their King being a 
> great 
> tactician/strategist then the other Razanian leaders.
> I can understand the Crusaders attack more north, taking over Teren 
> and 
> Cantor and sieging the southern states, but attacking westwards also 
> against 
> Karan should of been hard, especially also when the Crusader forces 
> would of 
> been spreaded a bit to thin conquering everywhere practicly at the 
> same 
> period of time?

OK.  The sequence of events was as such:

Early 1411:  THe Aryisans begin to mobilize for a renewed invasion.  The
Razanian kingdoms, lead by Karan and Bernar, prepare to meet them.  

Late1411:  The Aryisans move to occupy the remainder of Tesh and invde
Narton, minimal resitence is met and the Razanians gather in Karan.

Early 1412: The Razanians and Aryisans meet in pitched battle in Karan.
At the end of the day, the Aryisan hold the field, but have suffered
severe casulties.  Many razanian forces regather eithe in Karan or flee
north to Taranta and countries north of there.

Late 1412: The Aryisans move move south and besiege the small southern
city-states. 

1413:  The sieges continue.  The Razanian armies recover.  Karan and
Minot remain unoccupied andprotected by the largest army.  The northern
states are also unthreatened, though their army is not as strong.

And 1414 and later is up to you.




> So a quick invasion which you described shouldn't of been really 
> possible, a 
> slow invasion would of been more like it.

The timeline above should alliviate your concerns.  I think we had a
small misunderstanding, and I should have pphrased my summary a bit
better.
 
>


                                                   Aaron Nowack
"Never let reality get in the way of a good hypothesis."
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/5930/

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LouisPasztor
Louis Pasztor

Fri

Aug 27
1999

19:12Z

[Cel] Razanians

>OK.  The sequence of events was as such:
>
>Early 1411:  THe Aryisans begin to mobilize for a renewed invasion.  The
>Razanian kingdoms, lead by Karan and Bernar, prepare to meet them.
>
>Late1411:  The Aryisans move to occupy the remainder of Tesh and invde
>Narton, minimal resitence is met and the Razanians gather in Karan.
>
>Early 1412: The Razanians and Aryisans meet in pitched battle in Karan.
>At the end of the day, the Aryisan hold the field, but have suffered
>severe casulties.  Many razanian forces regather eithe in Karan or flee
>north to Taranta and countries north of there.
>
>Late 1412: The Aryisans move move south and besiege the small southern
>city-states.
>
>1413:  The sieges continue.  The Razanian armies recover.  Karan and
>Minot remain unoccupied andprotected by the largest army.  The northern
>states are also unthreatened, though their army is not as strong.
>
>And 1414 and later is up to you.

Okay thanks. But first before turn 1414 comes up, how do i submit my 
Actions? On the website, they have no listing for the Razanians in the 
Submit Action Form or unless want to do it by email? I read the rules, but i 
am warning that i may be a bit rusty or the first few turns in the way of 
submitting actions.

> > So a quick invasion which you described shouldn't of been really
> > possible, a
> > slow invasion would of been more like it.
>
>The timeline above should alliviate your concerns.  I think we had a
>small misunderstanding, and I should have pphrased my summary a bit
>better.
>
Okay, thanks. Did the Razanians have done any type of actions? The status of 
the Razanian Front and are they successful in their terrorist/sabotage  
attacks or whatever? The remaining results of that Church trying to be part 
of the Century Council? These things i would like to know, especially these 
actions were done after the previous player left.

-LordLMP


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TomRicks
Tom Ricks

Sat

Aug 28
1999

18:40Z

[Cel] Razanians

So you taking turn moves for the next year yet? :)

On Fri, 27 Aug 1999 10:04:46 cdt, Louis Pasztor wrote:

>isans advance. I

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LouisPasztor
Louis Pasztor

Sun

Aug 29
1999

01:16Z

[Cel] Razanians

>
>So you taking turn moves for the next year yet? :)
>
Hopefully. :) Only thing i need to know is which, where, who, how etc... to 
post the turns. The Action application on the Qaiyore website is outdated 
cause i can't send a turn as the Razanians.
-LordLMP

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LouisPasztor
Louis Pasztor

Mon

Sep 6
1999

18:13Z

[Cel] Razanians

Okay, so i know what to do now, almost anyway. But yet, still things i need 
to know like some of the past actions of the Razanians. Okay, they were idle 
since 1408, but they do have previous actions which i would like to know the 
results.

- The Secret Action that is not shown publicly, but since i will be playing 
the Razanians, would like to know what that secret action was so it does 
effect any of my future actions without me knowing.
- The Razanian Front action where they were trying to smuggle weapons in 
Aryisa to create some resistence groups, rebellion, disruption, terrorist 
activity, sabotage, riots etc... Would like to know the results of this 
cause i would need for some 1414 actions i have in mind. Also, wondering if 
they are part of the Century Council.
- Also would like to know of another action that needed three or turns for 
results, the Church Empyrean one where they tried to be part of the Century 
Council. I would like know the results of this action which should of been 
done by 1410 or so. Would be good t know if they are also part of the 
Century Council now.

These are the actions i only need to know for now. I thank Sam for sending 
the actions which have been done since 1408. I know what the Aryisa were 
upto since the Razanians turned NPS. I also have questions that still need 
to be answered and some information.

-Like i am still wondering and where and how i should be submtting a action? 
I know how to make a action, just don't in which form/way to submit it.
-I like the the razanians cost map which Aaron made and wondered if its 
possible to have a updated one and possibly a more detailed one like what 
places the Aryisa Army have taking over, places where they still don't have 
full control, show a line or whatever on the location of the Timber Veil. 
Just wondering. If Aaron cannot, can i? May use something better then 
PaintBrush to do it so i can have a better detailed map.  Its nice to have a 
map to base actions upon. :)

-LordLMP

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AaronENowack
Aaron E Nowack

Mon

Sep 6
1999

19:14Z

[Cel] Razanians

On Mon,  6 Sep 1999 13:13:21 cdt "Louis Pasztor" 
writes:
> - The Secret Action that is not shown publicly, but since i will be 
> playing 
> the Razanians, would like to know what that secret action was so it 
> does 
> effect any of my future actions without me knowing.

Unfortunatly, I do nto have acess to the secret actions, as I was not GM
at that time.  Dyl, could you please send me the secret actions?

> - The Razanian Front action where they were trying to smuggle 
> weapons in 
> Aryisa to create some resistence groups, rebellion, disruption, 
> terrorist 
> activity, sabotage, riots etc... Would like to know the results of 
> this 
> cause i would need for some 1414 actions i have in mind. Also, 
> wondering if 
> they are part of the Century Council.

THe results of thst particular action are on the web page.  As for the
results of there effort ssince then, the exact results are up to you, but
it would probably be a god idea to keep it inline with the 0 result on
that action.  The Razanian Front is not a member of the Century Council,
though they have been cooperating with it.

> - Also would like to know of another action that needed three or 
> turns for 
> results, the Church Empyrean one where they tried to be part of the 
> Century 
> Council. I would like know the results of this action which should 
> of been 
> done by 1410 or so. Would be good t know if they are also part of 
> the 
> Century Council now.

A quick roll gives me a result of -4 (Severe Failure).  Suggestion is
that the attempt fails and that the Church's bid for power has worsened
its relations with the Razanian monarchs.
 
> These are the actions i only need to know for now. I thank Sam for 
> sending 
> the actions which have been done since 1408. I know what the Aryisa 
> were 
> upto since the Razanians turned NPS. I also have questions that 
> still need 
> to be answered and some information.
>
OK.

> -Like i am still wondering and where and how i should be submtting a 
> action? 
> I know how to make a action, just don't in which form/way to submit 
> it.

As the form on the website does not send me the ations to me, the best
way is to either send your actions to the mailing list or directly to me
(which is how ll secrety actions should be handled).  As for the way to
write them, the best way to learn is to look at the actions shown on the
website.  Everybody has their own way to write their actions.  AS a bare
minimum you need a description of each action, the determinent you think
it should be based on, and any modifiers. 

> -I like the the razanians cost map which Aaron made and wondered if 
> its 
> possible to have a updated one and possibly a more detailed one like 
> what 
> places the Aryisa Army have taking over, places where they still 
> don't have 
> full control, show a line or whatever on the location of the Timber 
> Veil. 
> Just wondering. If Aaron cannot, can i? May use something better 
> then 
> PaintBrush to do it so i can have a better detailed map.  Its nice 
> to have a 
> map to base actions upon. :)

I am working on an udated Razanian Coast map.  (I'm also working on an
update to the main map, as well as a map of the Cedonian Empire at its
height.)



                                                   Aaron Nowack
"Never let reality get in the way of a good hypothesis."
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/5930/

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LouisPasztor
Louis Pasztor

Tue

Sep 7
1999

00:05Z

[Cel] Razanians

>THe results of thst particular action are on the web page.  As for the
>results of there effort ssince then, the exact results are up to you, but
>it would probably be a god idea to keep it inline with the 0 result on
>that action.  The Razanian Front is not a member of the Century Council,
>though they have been cooperating with it.

Oh, okay. Aslong as they are working together. :)


>A quick roll gives me a result of -4 (Severe Failure).  Suggestion is
>that the attempt fails and that the Church's bid for power has worsened
>its relations with the Razanian monarchs.

oh well, they can try again later.



>As the form on the website does not send me the ations to me, the best
>way is to either send your actions to the mailing list or directly to me
>(which is how ll secrety actions should be handled).  As for the way to
>write them, the best way to learn is to look at the actions shown on the
>website.  Everybody has their own way to write their actions.  AS a bare
>minimum you need a description of each action, the determinent you think
>it should be based on, and any modifiers.

Okay, can it be base upon more then one determinent? Just wondering.



>I am working on an udated Razanian Coast map.  (I'm also working on an
>update to the main map, as well as a map of the Cedonian Empire at its
>height.)
>
Okay then. But i seem to have another thing i forgot to ask. Since the 
Razanians are mostly comprise of independent Kingdoms with different 
descriptions, can each kingdom have a determinent bonus which can only be 
used when that peticuliar is part of a action and if the bonus is 
applicable? Like for example, Sout haves a University and are the most 
scholarly and should have a +1 bonus or whatever in scholastics or anything 
to do with technological advance, Karan have a military bonus due to their 
military bonus, Benar a naval bonus, Saragor a Wealth bonus etc.... Of 
course, these bonus' would be base upon the overall Determinents of the 
entire society. I am just wondering and these bonus would be base upon their 
descriptions of each kingdom on the website. The Razanians are a interesting 
Society. :)

-LordLMP

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